Choosing a religion

Duke · 09-19-2009, 09:32 PM

I'm not a particularly religious person, in fact if I were to be anything at all I would lean more toward superstitious. I've never really given too much thought to religion over my lifetime until quite recently.

For the past year or so, maybe more, I've had it in my head that I either want or need to go to church. I have no idea why or where this thought process has come from but it's starting to feel like time that I at least indulge this feeling to see where it takes me.

This is really the first time in my life that I've been willing or perhaps open minded toward introducing religion into my life to some degree. This does not mean I'm going to become a Bible Thumper by any means (I hate people who preach) and if anything, it's the preachers that have scared me away from the Church my entire life (assuming I was even interested which I don't really know).

Now that I've actually decided that I will spend some time exploring religion, I find I have no idea what religion to go for? I know that probably sounds pretty stupid to most of you but at least it's honest.

My question is, how does one go about choosing a religion?

Just to give you some insight into my "religious beliefs":

God: I don't know if I believe in God but I do like the idea of a God
Jesus: same as God, if there can be a God then there can be a son of God.
The Devil: If there's a God there has to be an equal and opposite force IMHO to have balance.
The Bible: never read it and what I have read I simply did not understand. I akin the Bible to IKEA instructions, confusing as h3ll, open to interpretation and probably not 100% accurate. The only thing IKEA instructions have over the Bible is at least you get an allen key.

The other thing I may as well point out is part of my search will be to find a Minister or Priest just as much as a religion. I simply am not the kind of person that can believe or even entertain a thought unless I believe in the person teaching.

Can you please help me gain some insight into choosing a religion that may be suitable given my above criteria? If you are suggesting a religion you believe in, please make sure to include why you believe in it and why you feel it would be a good choice for me to at least try.

Please, please, please do not preach to me because I will ignore any feedback you give because of it. Part of my opinion of some religious people is that they are exactly the same as politicians, they all talk nonsense, push it down your throats and will do ANYTHING to not allow you to make up your own mind.

Maybe this is a naive way of thinking but it's my way and you can't help me in this topic unless you're aware of it.

Thanks,

Ken

TKDLady · 09-19-2009, 10:17 PM

Don't know if I can help you or not. I am Catholic because that is what my family is and has been since before I was born, at least on my mom's side. I have attended a Church of Christ as a teen, my sisters church, but they are what I would consider preachy. It is a non-denominational church so not affiliated with any one type of religion. I have not gone to church regularly in years. I went when my kids were little and I wanted them to be baptized and go through confirmation. After that I let them make up their own mind. It is a personal choice. What works for me may not work for you. The people at my sister's church were great and when I was a teen it was good for me but I would not attend one of their churches again. I feel uncomfortable with all the "praise God" talk. There are a lot of rituals, for lack of a better term, in the Catholic religion but most of the people I have encountered are not overly preachy. My advice would be to attend the various church services in your area and see which one follows most of your beliefs. Talk to the ministers and priests and let your gut tell you if they are the one for you. Sorry I am not more help.

CCC · 09-20-2009, 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duke

I'm not a particularly religious person, in fact if I were to be anything at all I would lean more toward superstitious. I've never really given too much thought to religion over my lifetime until quite recently.

For the past year or so, maybe more, I've had it in my head that I either want or need to go to church. I have no idea why or where this thought process has come from but it's starting to feel like time that I at least indulge this feeling to see where it takes me.

This is really the first time in my life that I've been willing or perhaps open minded toward introducing religion into my life to some degree.

Do you suppose you're starting to think more about your mortality and what there is beyond life (afterlife)? Do you think you want to try to better understand the world around you, where we came from, where are we going? Do you think you're trying to find a sense of order in a world of chaos? I'm just throwing out some open-ended questions that first popped in my head.

Quote:

This does not mean I'm going to become a Bible Thumper by any means (I hate people who preach) and if anything, it's the preachers that have scared me away from the Church my entire life (assuming I was even interested which I don't really know).

I typically go to church twice a week, go to bible studies, help out at my church, so I could be considered by many a fairly religious person. I can understand how some people are rather over-the-top in their ministry and can have the opposite effect of what they had wanted. Today I was talking to such a person and made me a bit uncomfortable, even though I'm steadfast in my Christian faith.

That said, I wouldn't advise seeking a feel-good pastor who never talked against sin. A good pastor, out of love, wants his church members to avoid sin and grow their relationship with God and not have sin keep them out of heaven.

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My question is, how does one go about choosing a religion?

Interesting question and perfectly valid. Of course the temptation is to choose a religion that you're most comfortable with. The problem with that is we try to mold God into what we want God to be, but when if you think about it, an All-Mighty Creator should be molding us into what the Creator would like us to be, if we allow it.

This is why the Holy Bible is so strongly against man-made gods. How can something made by imperfect human beings be our gods? Doesn't make sense.

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Just to give you some insight into my "religious beliefs":

God: I don't know if I believe in God but I do like the idea of a God
Jesus: same as God, if there can be a God then there can be a son of God.
The Devil: If there's a God there has to be an equal and opposite force IMHO to have balance.

I would say we have "free will." We aren't pre-programed robots, incapable of decisions, slaves to our own program. We can choose what is good, or we can choose what is bad. I think that's what is so interesting about faith in God, that after all the temptations of sin, and we choose to overcome and love our Creator.

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The Bible: never read it and what I have read I simply did not understand. I akin the Bible to IKEA instructions, confusing as h3ll, open to interpretation and probably not 100% accurate. The only thing IKEA instructions have over the Bible is at least you get an allen key.

No doubt the Bible is tricky to read. As a Christian, here is my recommendations, as my Pastor has advised to new believers or those who are seeking...

Start in the New Testament with the Book of Luke. Why Luke? Because that was the Gospel written to the Gentiles. It'll give a good basis on the minstry and purpose of Christ. Then the book of Acts is the "sequel" to Luke, as it goes into the early church after the ascencion of Jesus.

The other Gospels are fine too, but were written to the Jews. The purpose of that is to show the fulfillment of Old Testament prophecy.

You'll also see different emphasis between the Gospels. For example, only Matthew and Luke talk about story of Jesus' birth whereas Mark and John start more into the Baptism. I could go more into it, but I don't want to bore you at this point.

Those who start in Genesis start to get bogged down in Exodus then really wonder what the point of Leviticus and Numbers is.

A good translation and study Bible is key. The King James Version is hard for a new Christian to read. There are modern translations that modernize outdated text (though it's still a good translation for some of the more poetic books of the Bible like Psalms). And a study Bible will help with some of the purpose, the context, and the history of the times.

Anyway I hope that came off as helpful to you Duke. I won't whack you with my Bible if you choose a different faith.

Duke · 09-20-2009, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCC

Do you suppose you're starting to think more about your mortality and what there is beyond life (afterlife)? Do you think you want to try to better understand the world around you, where we came from, where are we going? Do you think you're trying to find a sense of order in a world of chaos? I'm just throwing out some open-ended questions that first popped in my head.

I have been thinking more about my own mortality since a very close friend of mine passed away but to be perfectly honest, this feeling of considering some form of religion was present as much as a year before he passed on. This would lead me to believe that choosing a religion had little to nothing to do with thoughts of my own mortality.

As for a sense of order or any other larger and possibly intangible thought process, I'd have to say that has little to do with it. If I were to guess I'd have to say that I feel there is a lot about life I've learned via personal experiences and a lot more I've been made aware of via Lifesupporters but the one subject that has always remained elusive is religion. Unlike Politics where I'm simply uninterested, I know little about religion or choosing a religion not due to lack of interest but lack of knowledge.

I think a big part of me wants to gain some clarity in this area.

There may be other underlying factors pushing me toward religion at this time but I don't have a sense of what they may be.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCC

I wouldn't advise seeking a feel-good pastor who never talked against sin. A good pastor, out of love, wants his church members to avoid sin and grow their relationship with God and not have sin keep them out of heaven.

It may be relevant to point out that I went to Church a bit as a kid with my mom. During summer holidays I would also mow the Church lawns, vacuum and dust when the caretaker was away on vacation. I did this not so much for the Church as for the Minister as I thought he was one of the smartest and kindest of men I'd ever known until that point in my young life.

I believe that was the Catholic faith but I'd have to check with my mom on that one.

I may have worded my original statement incorrectly somewhat because when I mentioned I was also shopping for a Preach or Minister, I did not mean to imply that I'm looking for someone to pour sugar over sh1t. I want someone who can be frank about good and bad but who can do so in an honest and open environment. I need someone who is likable to talk to me otherwise I won't hear what their saying.

In other words I don't care what he's saying so much, more how he's saying it.

That said, regardless of how likable the Minister is, I won't attend if he fluffs the truth. In this regard I will test him/her one on one prior to ever attending again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCC

No doubt the Bible is tricky to read. As a Christian, here is my recommendations, as my Pastor has advised to new believers or those who are seeking...

Start in the New Testament with the Book of Luke. Why Luke? Because that was the Gospel written to the Gentiles. It'll give a good basis on the minstry and purpose of Christ. Then the book of Acts is the "sequel" to Luke, as it goes into the early church after the ascencion of Jesus.

The other Gospels are fine too, but were written to the Jews. The purpose of that is to show the fulfillment of Old Testament prophecy.

You'll also see different emphasis between the Gospels. For example, only Matthew and Luke talk about story of Jesus' birth whereas Mark and John start more into the Baptism. I could go more into it, but I don't want to bore you at this point.

Those who start in Genesis start to get bogged down in Exodus then really wonder what the point of Leviticus and Numbers is.

A good translation and study Bible is key. The King James Version is hard for a new Christian to read. There are modern translations that modernize outdated text (though it's still a good translation for some of the more poetic books of the Bible like Psalms). And a study Bible will help with some of the purpose, the context, and the history of the times.

I can say beyond a reasonable doubt that I won't even try to read the Bible prior to finding my way in this road to religion. Assuming I do find a faith and decide to participate regularly, then I may take a stab at it but for now I really don't have the desire whatsoever to do the extra work.

I know that likely sounds lazy and ignorant but it is the truth. I believe that if I go to Church, the Minister should teach me about the Bible and how it relates to both good and bad in our world. If he can't do this and in short order, I'll think he's a follower of faith rather than a believer in it and make my way out the door.

Duke · 09-20-2009, 10:08 AM

I wanted to respond to this separately because I didn't want it getting lost in the novella I wrote above:

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCC

Anyway I hope that came off as helpful to you Duke. I won't whack you with my Bible if you choose a different faith.

I've been getting to know you a little more with each of your posts over the past year CCC and I never once got the sense you were a preacher. By preacher I mean that you believe in something so strongly that only you can be correct in that thought.

I want you to know that I admire you for that my friend and it's something I'd like to embrace within myself because I do preach when I feel I know the most on a topic. It's one aspect of myself that I'm uncomfortable with and it's people like you who are helping me through it.

So I thought I'd use this response as a Thank You not only for your opinion and feedback here but for being someone I consider a friend.

Luba · 09-20-2009, 10:36 AM

Duke, our Beloved Minister belonged to the United Church of Canada. Here is a link for more information:

United Church Social Policy Positions | Beliefs

I will also ask him to give his Beliefs as we write to each other and keep in close contact. He had the unique Gift of passing Faith in God to others, that when I left the Church service I felt uplifted. It was a sad day when he suffered his Stroke and resigned.

xxALONExx · 09-20-2009, 03:03 PM

Duke, I'm going to be as straightforward as I can without being "preachy" or trying to beat you over the head with my beliefs.

I grew up attending a non-denominational church that followed very similarly to the Pentecostal tradition. That place was not for me. I knew that very early in life and I think it was about age 8 that I told my family I no longer wanted to go.

It took a lot for me to return to faith. That church and that tradition scared me off for the most part. I still believed in God and prayer and all that, but I didn't feel like church was for me. I was young and stupid and just thought that was what church was.

When I got to college I picked up a minor in religion and began to learn the differences between Judaism, Lutheranism, Catholicism, and so on. Ultimately I took what I was learning about those traditions as well as some Eastern religions and melded them all together to form the core of my beliefs. But I felt an incredible draw toward the Lutheran church.

When my wife and I found out that we were expecting (a child that ultimately miscarried) just a few months later I felt even more pushed toward church because I wanted my baby to grow up knowing some kind of religion. She and I met with the Pastor at a local Lutheran Church and just fell in love with him, with the church itself, and with the congregation.

I'm not going to make an impassioned speech pushing you toward Lutheranism. Really you need to figure out for yourself which faith tradition makes the most sense to you. For the wife and I Lutheranism fit perfectly. She grew up Catholic, but didn't like the strict rules and requirements of being Catholic. The church I grew up in was not ordered and structured enough for me. Lutheranism met in the middle for us with it's similarity to Roman Catholicism minus a few of the more strict requirements.

Make no mistake though that the Pastor and the congregation make or break a church. Don't feel bad about saying that you want to meet with the Pastor and make sure that he gives off the right vibe and not wanting to be part of his church if he doesn't.

Also don't feel bad about disagreeing with your faith tradition on certain things. I am as socially liberal as one can get. My social beliefs do not match the Lutheran tradition, even if it is becoming more liberal and accepting. But I am able to say that my faith is backwards on some issues and leave it at that. No matter the tradition you're going to have belief conflicts.

That said, I am glad to hear that you are feeling a calling toward faith. I think that faith and spirituality are wonderful gifts in life.

Duke · 09-21-2009, 09:57 PM

Terrific feedback all, very much appreciated.

I can say I do feel better about talking to the Priest, Minister, etc., and seeing for myself which suits me the best. I think I'll take a lot from this topic and use it as a application form for finding a suitable church.

A part of me almost wonders if I can simply give this link to my short list of perspective churches and have them help me decide if their church is right for me?

LovingSpirit · 10-23-2009, 06:48 AM

Hi Duke, I see that it's been a month or more since this topic was started and last responded to, but I wanted to share as well.

I was raised Catholic and moved away from it as I got older. Over my lifetime I have checked out several religions, most of which were based on Christianity. I saw the joy in these people for their god and their religion when I would attend their churches, but I did not feel what they felt. I have not read the bible all the way thru, and probably never will, but I have read enough to become uncomfortable with what I was reading. It doesn't matter to anyone but myself why I was uncomfortable, I just was. It only has meaning for me and I don't want to criticize anyone's religious choices, just as I wouldn't want mine criticized.

I feel I've been on a spiritual journey all of my life and I have read many books on spirituality along the way. For myself, I choose not to have a religion, however, that does not mean that I don't believe in a god, a higher power, a source energy. I am fond of several modern day spiritual teachers but the one who I am probably most fond of is Dr Wayne Dyer. His words reach out and touch my soul and resonate with me.

Over the years I too went thru times when I felt the need for something and I always thought that something was religion, but as I strolled back into religion each time, I realized that was not what I was seeking.

Seventeen or eighteen years ago when I hit my bottom with drugs and alcohol, I was introduced to the AA programs and it was there that we spoke only of a higher power and in that I found acceptance. I could believe in a higher power and thus began my journey back and forth thru religious doors. In the end, I opted to believe in a higher power/source energy/god of MY understanding and that is where I have been ever since. I feel comfortable here.

I live a decent life, am kind and helpful to others. I know the difference between good and bad and strive to stay on the side of good. I have my own set of beliefs that I feel comfortable with that do not include most of the Christianity teachings. This is my comfort zone. I have basically taken a little bit from each of the many spiritual books I have read over the years and I have found comfort and satisfaction in my own thing.

I think that one must understand that there is a difference between spirituality and Christianity and we have to decide for ourselves which is our calling. If one is to believe in an afterlife and reincarnation, such as I do, then it is easy to see that we are all here on this earth now at different levels of our spiritual development and that some of us are at the levels of following a christian based faith and some of us aren't.

I don't know if I've said anything to be helpful to you Duke, but I'd be interested in hearing what choices you've made since you've first started this thread. {{{Hugs}}}

Duke · 10-23-2009, 08:22 AM

I'll be honest with your here BrokenSpirit, reading your post I feel as if you've ripped open my chest and taken a good long look inside because I can see myself making a similar (if not exact) journey of what you posted, wow, very insightful.

The reason I've considered poking around religion is because of the fact I've never really tried to embrace it in my life. I do have questions but I'm completely unaware of both the questions and the answers, it just feels as if there's something there that needs attention from a spiritual side of things.

I'm at a point in my life (probably for the first time) where my mind is completely open and receptive to new ideas provided there are credible or valid reasons to embrace these ideas. Religion is one topic I'd like to explore somewhat because it did enter my life a bit as a kid but I wasn't open at the time so I got nothing out of it. In fact I got the opposite since our Minister (a terrific man) suffered a stroke. This event has bothered me ever since it happened and to this day I think very much about it when his name comes up or the subject of Religion is on the table.

I almost feel as if I have unfinished business with Religion and it's time to settle it, either I embrace it or I move on but one or the other has to be done for my own peace of mind.

Does this make any sense to anyone other than me?

Luba · 10-23-2009, 08:40 AM

It does make sense, Duke.

The Minister that you mention is a Great friend of mine and we keep in touch all the time. He would be glad to answer your questions if you would like to write to him.

Duke · 10-23-2009, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luba

It does make sense, Duke.

The Minister that you mention is a Great friend of mine and we keep in touch all the time. He would be glad to answer your questions if you would like to write to him.

Sure, why not PM me his details and I'll formulate something that gives him as much of the picture as possible without committing to mowing his lawn like before.

Luba · 10-23-2009, 09:03 AM

Here is a message to you from our Beloved Minister.

"Re. Ken and his desire to understand religious matters, I would prefer that he should contact me himself, as there is no 'stock answers' that give any solutions - every person has their own views and questions coming from their own understanding. It might help Ken to put his thoughts on paper, and I would certainly like to help if I could. I would, of course, treat anything in the strictest confidence, and I count it a privilege to help."

"....There are so many different 'religions' and I'm not really an authority on them all, but can only give my personal views."

I will PM you his address.

Duke · 10-23-2009, 10:38 AM

Thanks mim.

I can pretty much cut and paste virtually everything I've stated in this post already. Maybe I'll add a few things that come to mind and post it here to see what you all think?

LovingSpirit · 10-23-2009, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Quoted by Duke:
I almost feel as if I have unfinished business with Religion and it's time to settle it, either I embrace it or I move on but one or the other has to be done for my own peace of mind.

Does this make any sense to anyone other than me?

About seven years ago, after having lived 10 years of sobriety feeling certain that I couldn't have stayed sober without "God" and feeling comfortable with my "relationship" with him, I began to experience some extreme bullying in my job. (Yes, this is where bullying began for me) Prior to this time, I don't ever recall experiencing this) It must have been a journey I was meant to be on because everything that happened to me in my jobs as well as online, led me to question the existence of God on a level that threatened my sobriety and eventually changed me.

I became so angry with God that I was certain there could not possibly be a god. Period. Because if there was, I would not be suffering at the hands of other people in the way I was. I did a lot of reading and consulting with other people. I talked with people who were christians, buddhists, pagans, wiccans and athiests. I read about quantum physics and I became changed.

What I realized was that my concept of God and what God actually was, were two different things. My concept of God was still what I had learned as a little girl who whent to Catholic church, made her first communion, confessed my sins in confession and was taught that God was loving but that he would punish me if I sinned, thus instilling this odd sense of fear and love at the same time.

I was so angry and confused because I felt I had been lied to. The more I read and the more I learned, the more I began to feel as if religion was created to control people. I won't go into this here because it can be intense, but suffice to say, that's how I felt.

I lived for several years being angry at God and religion and searching for something. I stopped praying, I stopped my daily meditation which I'd done for the first 10 years of sobriety. I was confused so much that I couldn't bring myself to pray because I was certain that there was no one to hear my prayers.

I felt an emptiness because of this disconnect from God. But I knew that I didn't want to fill that emptiness with the lies of the past. My journey had led me past that now and I couldn't go back. It's hard to break habits of your childhood that have been instilled in you all of your life, even if you suddenly find yourself not believing them.

To make a long story short, I eventually found my way back to God, but it was not the God of my childhood. I had developed a new concept of God with everything I read and experienced, and with everyone I talked to. And that's exactly what I needed to do for me. I needed to find my own concept of God, my own concept of prayer, my own concept of good and bad.

It sounds like you may be embarking on a similar journey Duke. I won't profess to have all the answers, but if you have any questions, I will certainly try to be helpful.

So yes, I can understand what you mean when you say you have unfinished business with religion and that you must find an answer for yourself one way or another.

newstart · 12-21-2009, 05:44 PM

I totally understand what you're going through. I was brought up Catholic, but when I got older (old enough to think for myself), I wasn't so sure that I believed everything the way it had been explained to me. It's not a matter of trying to mold God into what I want or believe. It's hard to explain, but I'll try. As far as I can tell, religions are influenced by the people in charge. I don't trust that any of them are perfectly presenting/explaining God's Will. I have doubts that what some of them say is the real Truth. I decided I'd rather figure things out for myself than accept what someone else says. At least that's where I am now in my life.

I think it's wonderful when someone finds a religion they are comfortable with. Right now I'm ok with just believing in God, and doing my best to be a good person. In the future, I might need something more organized and defined. It sounds like that's where you are right now. I wish you the best of luck in finding what you need.

newstart

Mondo · 01-04-2010, 06:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duke

Now that I've actually decided that I will spend some time exploring religion, I find I have no idea what religion to go for? I know that probably sounds pretty stupid to most of you but at least it's honest.

Do you need to embrace religion to have a meaningful life and existance?
Is it curiosity about religion in general?
Do you want to know answers to the mysteries of life and the universe (then you could argue should you be religious at all and get a subscription to new scientist?) or be part of a community with a shared sense of beliefs or values? (In which case does that have to be of a religious nature?)
Why also restrict yourself to western religions? Hinduism, Islam, Buddhism, Shinto for example are all religions not tied to ethnic background. Even atheism is being toted as some kind of sudo religion these days!

I'm not sure I agree with your reasoning to become religious though Duke.

I've known you a long time and you've always been a person who believes in themselves (there are religions for that too!) and what they are doing, been morally upstanding and generally a nice guy without the need for an instruction manual or guide.

Duke · 01-04-2010, 09:58 AM

Just to clarify my friend, I'll answer all of your questions individually.

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