United States Welfare - Page 2

Stone · 03-13-2005, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by star_64

Quote:

Originally Posted by Merika

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stone

Jeeze now I really want to move to Canada, I pay 1,100 a month for a duplex

it would be worth paying those extra bux not to have the snow! i'm jealous! LOL!

LMAO actually I was at the water park with my son all day... AND I got a suntan 8) LMAO WE live on a costal area the duplex I live in is appraised at 500K that's SICK and overpriced. I used to rent out mobil homes here and the rent was reasonable but the county took that option away. Nobody is allowed to rent mobil homes anymore.

Vautrin · 03-13-2005, 04:54 PM

Part of the problem is malpractice claims. They run into millions of dollars, which also must be paid in some way or the other.

Recently over here in the Netherlands there was a case for 30.000 Euro's / US$ 35.000 . That is extremely high according to Dutch standards.

Waiting times are only a serious issue, when there is little time to waste. MRI-scans can be very useful, and so are cardiac checks et cetera.
Given a certain area, you can put statistics to work, and ascertain that with xx machines you have a 99.99% probability that the waiting time is less than yy minutes.

And remember, it is the poor who can't afford the health insurance who lose out. Or those who are screwed over.

darkangelism · 03-13-2005, 04:58 PM

yeah, the people who cant afford it do lose out, but there is no easy solution.

Vautrin · 03-13-2005, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stone

LMAO actually I was at the water park with my son all day... AND I got a suntan 8) LMAO WE live on a costal area the duplex I live in is appraised at 500K that's SICK and overpriced. I used to rent out mobil homes here and the rent was reasonable but the county took that option away. Nobody is allowed to rent mobil homes anymore.

500K? That is insane. Congratulations on the sunstan. Hope he enjoyed the day as well.

Stone · 03-13-2005, 05:02 PM

Malpractice IS a huge problem. Wich beats the WHOLe INDustry. Actually legally I could cliam malpractice on Noah's doctors but I am not going to.

The insurance for hospitals and doctors is an unbelievable amount.

The underwritting that Insurance companies use could also be cleaned up but it won't. I do think that citizens with disibilities should have priority over immigrints that was the point I was trying to make. Like you said, If I moved to Spain, Canada ect I wouldn't get health care unless I was a citizen WTF isn't it the same here.

Vautrin · 03-13-2005, 05:10 PM

As I see it, these illegal immigrants get their treatments, because the doctors are forced by their hippocratic oath to help them. If they would not do that, they would violate the codes of their profession, and probably be sued for that.
As the costs are to be paid by the people who pay premiums, it makes the health care more expensive for people who pay their premiums.

Does not make sense, I know.

What could you gain by claiming malpractice on Noah's doctors?

darkangelism · 03-13-2005, 05:20 PM

i hate malprctice lawyers, like, john edwards.

stone, the reason why you dont have to be a citizen to get stuff here is cause it is private healthcare, they earn a profit from seeing people, wheras in canada it comes from taxes and if you are not a citizen you are not paying into the system. Also you would probably spend more time on waiting lists and in waiting rooms for noah if you were in canada

Merika · 03-13-2005, 05:36 PM

It's easy to disagree with the concept of mal-practive lawyers....until you need one. Within all the bad....they have played a great role in helping regulate doctors who thought they were Gods.....but in reality...didn't know their A$$ from a hole in the ground.

Granted...if those attorney's couldn't make 40% , plus expenses, perhaps they wouldn't dig so deep. This is why Bush passed to law to cap what they could gain from these situations.

Vautrin · 03-13-2005, 05:52 PM

In the Netherlands part of your health care insurance is paid as part of your wages. A further premium has to be paid (compulsory), depending on the amount of money you make. That will change in 2006 though.

I think by doing so, you would qualify for Dutch healthcare, even if you are not a national. I would have to look it up though.

I know of a Dutch-Korean couple, and the Korean man has access and rights to the Dutch system.

The madness of it all ...

Merika · 03-13-2005, 06:02 PM

I think it all comes out the same V. If people in the US paid in sales tax and out of their paycheck the same amount as other countries do....they too would be covered.....even if it were with private health insurane as opposed to a national plan. Truth is...they don't WANT to pay...but yet fuss over not having health care.

My parents don't want to pay more for their prescriptions drugs than the people in Canada do....but they don't want to pay the same taxes toward the benefit either. They want to hold on to their money to support their 2.5 house(s) retirement fund and then gripe because the government isn't giving them reduced prescriptions. It's hard to feel sorry for them.

You get what you pay for.....and you don't get something for nothing. It's that simple.

darkangelism · 03-13-2005, 06:05 PM

Right, the money taken out of wages is roughly the same amount as the average cost of US healthcare, so in the US system some people pay a lot less, like because im almost never sick, if i wasnt under my parents healthcare i still wouldnt pay a huge amount, and on the other side of the spectrum there are people like stone who have to pay a lot.

Vautrin · 03-13-2005, 06:15 PM

That might be true Merika. But the thing is, with the known risks of Noah, Heather can't insure him properly anymore. And that is the whole problem.
In the Netherlands she has to be accepted (with Noah and Ally) regardless of the medical history of her and her children. Which would cover Noah's health problems.

In short even if she were to act responsibly now, she won't benefit from it anymore. That hurts. Because of how the system works, they will punish her individual effort. She can work 80 hours a week and still have nothing. Or she can become a stay at home mom, who is on the limited social security in Florida.
Neither option is appealing.
It even affects her life in a more personal way. How to approach Greg? Only she has the answers to that. And I really hope she can find them.

DA: the amount taken out of wages depends on the height of the wages. So the people with financially speaking the strongest shoulders pay most towards the system. That is the only way a socialized health care would make sense.

In Finland even traffic fines are based on wealth. So a poor man might be fined for $100 for speeding, but a billionaire might pay $1,000,000 for exactly the same offense.

Merika · 03-13-2005, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vautrin

In Finland even traffic fines are based on wealth. So a poor man might be fined for $100 for speeding, but a billionaire might pay $1,000,000 for exactly the same offense.

What an EXCELLENT idea!!!!

Health Ins is the same way. I pay the exact amount for the same coverage as a millionaire.

Cause...'We are all EQUAL'....BWAHAHAHAHA! What a joke!

darkangelism · 03-13-2005, 06:29 PM

but see that isnt fair to the rich, most of them worked hard to earn that money, and by charging them more you are basically saying that two people shouldnt be treated the same because one earns more money. What would the point of being rich be if i have to give more away to pay for the same thing, i mean even here its not fair 50% of all taxes are paid by 5% of the population.