I'm so frustrated.

Paul · 12-14-2005, 06:16 PM

Suddenly support is dropping for Bush and people are against the war. Finally people are standing up against the White House because they realize the Patriot Act is unconstitutional and violates civil liberties. Suddenly there's an outcry and people are up in arms over this. Are people just stupid and blind or what? Where were these people 4 years ago when we were telling them they were being taken advantage of? Is everyone a sheep and just follows the crowd? This is insane. My honest opinion is, if you don't pay attention to what's going on with your government and your country, if you don't appreciate what you have and say NO to anyone who tries to take it away, then you don't deserve to have the freedoms. They've been taken away a long time ago and it's just now that people are realizing it. I'm sorry but I'm so peeved right now, this just makes me sick.

darkangelism · 12-14-2005, 07:06 PM

The fact is that hindsight is 20/20, so based on the facts at the time those decisions were correct...i still support the war, the patriot act. The patriot act doesnt hurt the average person. Id rather be safe and have my "rihts violated" then be dead. You should post this on my site... Dogs of Liberty because that whole site is for politics discussion.

Paul · 12-15-2005, 12:42 AM

That's where I disagree, I don't believe they were the correct decisions. And I don't believe in conspiracy theories, I believe in a conspiracy possibility and it's truely surprising to me that so many people can be hoodwinked so easily.

I'd write more but my hand is really sore right now, I'll get back to this shortly.

Thanks for the invite, I may take you up on that!

darkangelism · 12-15-2005, 01:49 AM

conspiracy about what?

Ayla · 12-15-2005, 12:33 PM

Personally I'm torn over the Patriot Act. Part of me thinks it's a good thing and that some rights have to be given up to be safe in the world we live in today.

Vautrin · 12-15-2005, 08:16 PM

Next question is, are we more safe then?

darkangelism · 12-15-2005, 08:22 PM

well its hard to judge, there havnt been any new terrorist attacks. But we dont know how many of our phone calls and such that are tapped actually result in that or whether its just luck. But better be safe then sorry.

Vautrin · 12-16-2005, 01:57 AM

Dutch secret service is well known for its invasive procedures. Last week we had another major scandal, which makes you think only idiots can apply for such jobs.

One agent had left diskettes with all kinds of data in his car, sold it, and never bothered to get the diskettes back in a period of 2 (!) years. So anyone could have access to the data on the disks. Now someone has told a bit of what was (supposedly) on those diskettes. Included on the disks were phone-numbers of agents in other countries, I think they were US and British, but I am not 100% certain. And details of the sex-life of one politician.
The responsible agent has been suspended, so we may guess that indeed the disks are real (how could you suspend an agent that does not exist? Or are we going to assume that the agent did not exist either, and that our Justice system calls a lie, "the truth"?).

And information on politicians, and political parties also seems to have been gathered by the Dutch intelligence service. Now, that is where it gets scary: if your private life comes under investigation, there are billions of ways to "leak" the information to the press, and destroy one's career and even life. You do not even need to have a skeleton in the closet then. That is not democracy.

And everyone can adopt code language on the phone. Or in emails. Or appear to be secular (if religious fundamentalism receives more attention), both in phone calls and emails, but excepting the private sphere.

I am not too optimistic about these measures. Even within the US itself, there are quite a number of insane people who think blowing up government buildings would not be a bad thing. Now, if you are going to ask in an opinion poll, you are not going to get such answers.

darkangelism · 12-16-2005, 03:00 AM

yeah we can never protect agisnt people lik timothy mcvieigh. I never understood that tradegy until i mobed to oklahoma.

Merika · 12-21-2005, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul

Suddenly support is dropping for Bush and people are against the war. Finally people are standing up against the White House because they realize the Patriot Act is unconstitutional and violates civil liberties. Suddenly there's an outcry and people are up in arms over this. Are people just stupid and blind or what? Where were these people 4 years ago when we were telling them they were being taken advantage of? Is everyone a sheep and just follows the crowd? This is insane. My honest opinion is, if you don't pay attention to what's going on with your government and your country, if you don't appreciate what you have and say NO to anyone who tries to take it away, then you don't deserve to have the freedoms. They've been taken away a long time ago and it's just now that people are realizing it. I'm sorry but I'm so peeved right now, this just makes me sick.

I'm not a personal supporter of the Patriot Act. What's kinda funny though is that people are all against that when they are willing to put butt loads of money into the complete navigational systems like 'TomTom' in their vehicle and the whole d*mn world knows where they are at any given moment. Or credit cards and ATM's.....like no one can follow that?????????????????

It's a stupid political argument. Your opinion will lay depending on what slant you read about it. But the truth is....WTF? Anyone can follow you anywhere. It's a moot point.

Paul · 01-06-2006, 05:19 AM

lol I love your post Merika, how true!

I'm not here to offend anyone, I'm just sick of the lies and cover-ups that I whether anyone else agrees with them or not. It hurts me to see what is happening in America.

Here's a video for any interested parties to chew on, one of multiple links available on the subject, most containing much more detail. It's about 9/11, I'm not posting it to start a debate, I'm not going to argue over the points made herein, it's just another point of view that I'm sharing:

http://70.84.33.210/~infomedi/video/...alpreview2.mov

btw Iran is next. Mark my words, no joke, it will happen and they won't even bother coming up with excuses why for this one.